Hmmm????

[2 of 3]

This is 90 minutes long. I'd like to hear your take on it.

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-2451908450811690589&q=Occupation+101&total=331&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

[mervap]

I watched a good bit of this vid...as with most issues, how one feels about something depends greatly upon one's point of view. The view expressed herein is distinctly Palestinian, with the Israelis painted in a bad light...it is true that facts are always facts, but motivations and agendas cloud the picture.
I do hear many folks here in the US saying that the Jews and Palestinians have been fighting forever, and that does seem to be untrue...it's sad that such a sacred piece of land is at the center of the very thing that all 3 religions (that sprang forth from there) abhor: violence.

[mi]

I do hear many folks here in the US saying that the Jews and Palestinians have been fighting forever, and that does seem to be untrue...

Oh that's true alright... I don't even want to get into this (but I'm sure I will...).  Got a feeling I'm lucky I haven't got time to watch all this video (I will try though, sooner or later).

[mervap]

That is precisely why I like having conversations about subjects like this....I get to learn about things from a ground-level point of view. With the internet, it's hard to determine what is fact and what is not...any input from you, Mi, would be most enlightening.

[mi]

it is true that facts are always facts, but motivations and agendas cloud the picture.

How true... and even facts are not always that obvious. We always hear how foreign newspapers report about our attacks in Palestinian territories, sometimes "forgetting" to mention that these came as reactions to suicide terror attacks...don't get me wrong or anything - the last thing I'm trying to say is that Israel is perfect or never does any wrong - nothing could be further from the truth, I probably know that better than anyone. Our soldiers behavior towards Palestinian citizens is often sickening. I just don't accept that this can justify or explain in any way organized terrorist attacks in the center of our cities. People here hear about cases of our soldiers abusing Palestinian citizens and say things like - "the occupation corrupts the minds of our young generation. You can't take 19 year old boys and give them weapon and resposability and not expect that to get into their heads" - I don't accept that rubbish either. 19 year olds can be as human and sensitive as anyone else. The fact that they are "given weapon and responsibility" is no excuse for anything - if it's not violence towards Palestinian citizens, there are plenty of cases of abuse of senior soldiers towards rookies - even among those who don't come anywhere near Palestinian population. This exists in every army in the world, I know, it's just more often "on the agenda" here, as every one is obliged to go to the army. I'm not sure why, but this specific sort of cruelty can make me angry like nothing else does...

[mervap]

We always hear how foreign newspapers report about our attacks in Palestinian territories, sometimes "forgetting" to mention that these came as reactions to suicide terror attacks

There are certainly news outlets that do this, but on the whole I think the press here covers the situation in a fairly equitable fashion...if anything, I'd say it favors Israel slightly.

Some prejudices are bred in us when we are quite young...as a youngster in the US south, I was told by my Mom that all people are equal in the eyes of God, that people of all races are to be respected as...humans. As I started school, I discovered that not all the boys and girls had had this type of upbringing and found that some parents had taught their kids that African-American children were of an inferior race. With that type of starting point, it is hard for me to imagine that they feel any differently now...I wonder how kids on both sides of the conflict in your country were raised...I suspect there are a great many who were raised in the same way I was....that all people are of value and should be respected. But I also would think that there are also many who were raised to look upon the 'other side' with nothing but contempt. Those are the types of cycles that are so hard to break...

[mi]

...I suspect there are a great many who were raised in the same way I was....that all people are of value and should be respected.

I was raised pretty much the same way, but I also grew up with grandparents who survived the holocaust, so I was aware, from a very early age, that not everyone feels the same way. In our house anti-racism was of major importance, but I know plenty of other parents raise their children to believe that all arabs are terrorists and dangerous. I remember once, as a small child, I heard a girl in school using the word "arab" as a curse. I once repeated that at home and my dad gave me quite a scolding - I remember him saying: "Hey, this kind of talk will not be tolerated in this house young lady, OK?" or something like that...

Within the Palestinians territories it's quite different, I'm afraid - they teach their children to hate us from the moment they're big enough to understand something - at least that's the impression we get. Yes, I know - they have their reasons to hate us, I'd be the last one to deny that, but they - at least the extreme ones, are only willing to see their part of the conflict. For them the only solution is violence and killing - can't make much progress like that, you know...

As for the arab minority living in Israel, that's a different matter - I met so many of them in college and we always got on great together. We never felt there was any difference between us. Just never disscussed these issues, you know...that was some sort of a silenced agreement between us. It's only in times of war when I sometimes lose my mind a little. I told you a while ago about the arab cashier woman in the grocery store, who annoyned me for some reason and in the end I just said "Oh, why don't you just go blow yourself up in Gaza..." -that was an awful thing to say, I know, I just wasn't myself at the time - people were killed in terror attacks practically every day, and we were all on the verge of explosion at any given moment.  It's one of the things I should learn - restrain myself before saying things I regret later, especially now that I have a child - I'd  never want him to hear me talking like that.
In fact, there was another incident, around the time of the grocery store one. Two arab boys walked by me in the street one day, and began to "make faces" at me or what ever you call it. They were a lot younger than me, so it was nothing serious... I was so annoyed at the moment so I just asked "why don't you just tell me when the next terror attack is, so I can be ready", and actually they said something very nice. Their answer was  - "Hey, we're just as Israelis as you are, OK?"...